Hey......the deal is done.............thank god for PM's on Sway's. I have NO problem with sealing and scuf sanding. Whatta bunch of wimps! Look at my biceps! Arnie would be proud!!
Now, I just saw another thread with everyone spreading horror stories freaking out about to vent or not to vent.
In that thread I replied that throughout the 80's I never vented once (well, except to maybe some shoulder hopper at Rincon). All that foam was hotwired 1.5 or lighter. The surfboards were light colors the sailboards anything and everything........no delams, and no blow ups...........even in cargo holds.
Oh, to spackle or not to spackle? The hard lines paint great with spackle but is the adhesion okay compared to epoxy/balloon slurry and scuffing......? All my 80's stuff was done with the slurry and scuffing.
i agree they are a bunch or wimps the only reason pu foam is still used is anyone can shape it it is cheap raw material is half of eps or epp foam, and the boards dont last they ding and break easy
which is good for the manufacture but not for the consumer...and sooner or later all the pu foam sharpers will die from cancer
i only shape polypropylene foam. yes it is a little harder to shape like eps but at leased i am not going to die from it.
like all the sharpers that i have been going to paddle out for,it is 100% environmentally friendly no v.o.c. it wont deck ding, you can glass it with polyester or epoxy and it is 25% lighter than pu foam, they surf better (better flex) and last 3 time longer than pu or eps foam boards to me its a no brainier but you don't need a brain to surf or drive a car (just trying to make a point)
......thought I heard (read) someone mention that Walker's was polypro........maybe someone can clarify that for us.
I shape everything that helps pay my mortgage. Rather than worrying about dying from 40 years of shaping Clark Foam, I think about other things..like design.
Somwhere read "worrying works.......99% of the things I worry about never happen".
As clarification, Walker's formulas were all polyurethane however he used a significantly different polyol in his formulation then did Clark.
LT....thanks for the clarification........and you would certainly know. BTW thanks for making Walker available thru the Ice 9 "Mowses" Formula.........I'm loving shaping the foam and just had a rider come back from 3 wks in Bali riding a 2 day 6'5" shorty I made for him from your Mowses 6'6"HPS before he left. He surfed the crap out of it and he not only loved the ride but the board came back in excellent condition.
It turned out very light with the typical 4/4 single 4 speed finish and he is really impressed as am I.
Thanks again.......can't wait to see the heavier Feather formula in Moses for funshapes and longboards.
Okay, so ask you shall receive............Stu from Ice 9 just dropped blanks and showed me the new Mowses Featherweight Formula in a longboard blank that Terry Martin skinned.........the foam is unbelieveable! Such the fine cell structure.....beautiful stuff. This will make for terrific classic longboards or anyone wanting strength in the core. It is said to shape just like the lighter Mowses............... which is a dream. If you haven't tried it you are missing it big time. Good foam is good foam, and I don't care what the label is.......if it's good, USE IT!
Since this thread originally started about foam.........who can comment on using the blue extruded foam? We may as well get to it. Gassing? Delam? Finish shaping with 60 grit works? Blowing up like popcorn......special processing with micro holes? Who knows? Let's hear from you. The stuff resists water unbelieveably well and is light and strong as all get out...........but!
NO WALKER IS PU FOAM TDI BASE, AND I DON'T WORRY ABOUT DYING FROM SHAPING FOAM, BECAUSE I ONLY SHAPE POLYPROPYLENE FOAM
We make our own EPS blanks, and I always assumed anyone else who used more than a few per week
would do the same. So I guess I was wrong, along with you. We also have some relatively sophisticated
cutting technology that yields a very close-tolerance blank for each individual board. It's hard to tell where
the blank making ends and the shaping begins.
After working with our EPS blower to get the foam fine-tuned, and coming up with new tools and methods,
I can honestly say that I prefer shaping EPS. When I infrequently shape a PU blank nowadays, it feels weird
and I wonder what that funny piece of wood is doing running down the center.
We're not at all married to EPS, however. If we could find another foam that worked better in our technology,
we'd use it. But EPS has a combination of attributes that just can't be matched by any other currently available
product, for our use.
MD.............singing the praises of EPS.......imagine that!
I have felt what you are expressing here as I have moved through different available foams from different suppliers. I guess if I hook up a vac to my planer then I wouldn't become the abominable snowman on sticky days and my eyes wouldn't burn from the talc or whatever gets in them (uh, on 2nd thought, they probably burn from the styrene!)
Some folks just don't like the ride EPS offers........I never had a problem with it. Maybe designers look at riding the different mediums more analytically than emotionally. Sometimes I loved the hollower bouyant feel of EPS on boards I didn't want to bog down in gutless surf. Sailboards got off the line in light wind easier and SUP's don't have to be a back breaker getting them down to the surf.
Let's face it.......you cannot equal the strength to weight ratio of EPS in PE/PU......no how, no way...physics!
Is there another foam out there? Maybe, probably..........is it economical enough? Maybe, probably not, at least at this point. However there may be new ways to lighten up existing cores of the conventional materials that we have yet to incorporate into them. Maybe an inflatable surfboard isn't so far fetched? Maybe it could have a hard deck and bottom with some rails ribs that allow collasping the thing into a thin sandwich and then you inflate it to a desired stiffness rating desired. On the bottom skin are some high density inserts for the fin system.
Maybe some day we will look back at this thread and realize we were dinosaurs speculating about what the norm now is.
I seem to recall someone building a corrogated paper or cardboard surfboard and surfing it at Makaha or somewhere........this was late 60's or early 70's..........forget foam use recycled treated aerated paper?