Hey, any suggestions on this?

So, my retirement won’t be filled with globetrotting to exotic locales to surf. And that’s cool. But I do have kind of a plan. I’ve started building myself an 18’ RV that I can drag to different spots along the Texas coast (where I live) to surf and hang,  as well as venture both East and West to places I’ve never been. I imagine my jaunts will last from days to weeks, and I’m very much looking forward to wandering. Having been a carpenter for more than 40 years, the project itself is not too daunting. But I’m thinking of several different ways to skin the exterior. Of course it’ll look like your typical RV, but I would like the exterior finish to be kind of artistic and different. I’m going to cover the exterior walls with 1/4" luan plywood and was wondering about fiberglass for the exterior skin with some kind of color work. Steve at Thayercraft has some 60" 7oz glass that I could probably do two layers of glass over the whole thing for around $350 glass cost. Y’all have any thoughts on the feasibility/durability of this? Or color work ideas? Of course I can buy fiberglass skin panels or aluminum  from an RV supplier, but I’d prefer to do something different. And I have some other skinning ideas. But I thought I would ask those with lots of glassing experience what their thoughts are. Any help or suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

Josh Martin - martinshapes on instagram - built this cool camper shell with foam and fiberglass, check him out on instagram maybe get some ideas

 



Interesting.While surfboard techniques and materials are nice, I dunno if they’re really neccessary and they do cost more. And hey, it’s a land yacht, right?

Not sure about two layers of 7 oz cloth, seems like a lot of work doing two layers as opposed to say one layer of mat, as you’d see in boat work.Roll it on, roll out the bubbles, all good, quick and easy. Doing an 18’ trailer with two layers of cloth sounds like a race between the resin hardening and doing a good job. Mat is pretty much made for fast work.Boat grade resin, nothing fancy, weight isn’t really an issue.

Spray foam insulation inside between the frames would stiffen things up nicely, plus insulation is something you’d want anyhow. Spray foam is better insulation than the fiberglass most use plus it pretty much makes it into one really strong lightweight structure. Conduit set before foaming for present and future wiring and so on. You know how to do all that. 

Use boat windows and such, vents, what have you, salvaged from houseboats? No need to reinvent the wheel.

Outside? Boat gel coat, again rolled or sprayed, play with colors and textures.add pigment and so on and there you go…

Or there’s this - kinda cute and it appears nearly turn-key, get some plastic flamingos and there ya go. These come up a lot. 

hope that’s of use

doc…

Biggreen you could probably check out some of the car restoration forums. I remember coming across a couple with people making hard tops for their convertibles when I was looking into modifying a hard top for my jeep. The basic process was to build a foam core/plug. Shape it as desired to fit and look good. Glass it, if I remember correct they just used mat. Sand, bondo, sand, bondo, sand, etc until it is smooth and flawless. Finally paint so it matches. Hope this helps.

I’ve done quite a bit of building myself and here are my thoughts.  The fiberglass contractors that laminate outdoor decks and shower stalls suggest that the plywood substrate be Douglas fir.  They have told me that the resin and glass doesn’t bond well with anything else and will eventually delaminate.  Taking that into consideration I wouldn’t use luan. I would use a minimum of 3/8" Doug fir with a frame that is well braced. The thinner substrates have morewaves and buckles to deal with.  Insulate with foam panels.  For color look into a vinyl wrap like you see on commercial trucks.  The wraps are pricy, but they can produce anything that you could imagine.

Big Box luan is CRAP. Even glassed. Much of it not even made with waterproof glue. 

I’d use MDO. Used for all sorts of stuff that takes the weather. Signage, Boats, Displays etc. No need for glass and depending on your comfort level, may not need insulation.  

Medium density overlay panel, or MDO panel, is a paintable surface made of DF plywood with a weather-resistant resin overlay bonded to the wood by heat and pressure. The overlay, which has at least 27% resin content, resists water, weather, wear and degradation. 

 

Wow! What a great bunch of good info!

Huck, that cabover is badass. And I bet it’s light as hell. Weight is definitely something I’m going to be watching. And I’ll be using a lot of my scrap eps to cut into insulation panels.

Doc…I’ve never used mat fiberglass. Need to look into it. Guess that was the board builder in me coming out. I’m going to fab the wall sections like a house framer would. Figured I’d sheath, maybe glass, install windows and everything like you say before putting in place. 

 

Phillipjohnw, it’s interesting you mention that. I’ve been looking and the nose covering on many RV’s is a thick layered glass cover. I’d wondered about doing something like that. Mat fiberglass again. In certain ways doing something like that would make life easier.

Surfifty…good to know. I would never have thought of that. I was just thinking luan because it’s light and relatively inexpensive. The place I buy my block foam for blanks in Houston will cut whatever size you like. Thought I’d fab the walls something like the stressed skin panels used on timber frame houses. And if I do go fiberglass skin I even thought of Boardlams and their print on fiberglass capabilities.

You’re right unclegrumpy. And I don’t know about your neck of the woods, but over here the damn stuff is now $27 a sheet! It’s been so long since I’ve seen MDO that I’d forgotten about it. If you’re out West I imagine Doug Fir is ubiquitous. Here most of our sheet stock is pine based because that’s what grows and is milled in our area.

Thanks so much everyone for some great info. I’d post pics, but I may need Huck’s help. Lately, when I’ve tried to post with pics I get an error message and “please try again later”. 

Thanks again!

Email some to me at doghousereilley@yahoo.com I’ll see if I can post them

Doc…I’ve never used mat fiberglass. Need to look into it. Guess that was the board builder in me coming out. I’m going to fab the wall sections like a house framer would. Figured I’d sheath, maybe glass, install windows and everything like you say before putting in place. 

All good, Nail or screw and glue the ply to the framing, of course, 2x3 framing is prolly plenty. Ceiling/roof joists, depends on what you’re thinking, if you want to, say, carry a small boat on the roof or similar 2x6 and heavier ply might be a move. 

You mention EPS, so I’m figuring you’re used to epoxy? I’d go with polyester boat resin for this, the stuff that comes in five gallon pails. Cheap and cheerful. Goes on with a long handled roller, rather than a squeegee/pour. Then you use a roller like these to get the bubbles out and get it flat. There’s about a zillion videos on using them in boat work and industry. 

If you can, I’d tag along with somebody else’s insulation job, get that spray foam insulation done rather than using scrap styrene foam. It makes ridiculously strong panels, very rigid.

What are you using for a frame/chassis?

doc… 

I like the one with the shaper using surfboard blanks! Take what you know and run with it!

Boat glassing seems so different from surfboard glassing, often a matter of bulking up rather than pushing the limits for higher strength and lighter weight. Sometimes I hear of various chopped strand mat materials not playing well with epoxy as they have a styrenated binder. Some of the more common stitched biax and mat combinations are said to be styrene-free.I have spending more time working on boats than boards lately but have not done any ‘heavy’ boatwork glassing yet or can say I know anything about gelcoats or bottom paints. A guy on another forum was talking about drilling a 2" hole through 2" of glassing at a angle near the keel to place a transducer.

I built one small sailboat out of big-box 1/4" plywood, epoxy, and one layer  6 or 7.5 oz plain weave on the bottom and taped seams elsewhere. Places that were 2 layers deep of epoxy and glass look good, one layer looks OK with some pinholes, and where plain epoxy was just used as paint over plain plywood looks peeled and gray and miserable after 5 years of constant weather. The insides that stayed out of sun and weather still look nice and  ‘bristol’. I would have done better to do 2-3 layers light cloth and finish it off with paint, and then tarping it when not in use. It is a very small boat, the time to rework might be better spent building something new…

A few things-

First, I am a boatbuilder by trade. Commercial fishing vessels my specialty. Preferably wood, but I’ve done steel, aluminum and glass. 

Now, stitch and glue (the taped seams ply construction) was popularised by a guy called Dynamite Payson, quick and cheap and essentially disposable. Then you get into the bigger stuff. Where 2" holes through thick hulls are no big deal, do that every day.*

Some considerations- 

First, expense. 

An 18’ trailer, you’re looking at laminating something like  5-600 square feet. A 10’ longboard is around 40. That’s a lot of resin and cloth. And a lot of money, especially if you’re talking epoxy and two layers of cloth, plus a fill coat plus a gloss versus one layer of mat, polyester resin and gelcoat. The epoxy is twice to five times the price per gallon, two layers of cloth about three times the price of one layerof mat. Triple stitched fabrics and similar? Yeah, if you’re building a high end yacht.

If you start getting too expensive, well, you can buy decent used travel trailers quite reasonable too. Craigslist.  Us retired guys have to watch our pennies.

Strength? Yeah, if you’re building it out of foam epoxy might make a difference. But then you’ll have to laminate the inside too. Unless you are using something like Coosa Board, but that runs around $350 a 4x8 sheet and even then you need framing and fasteners and adhesives and it’s best if you at least roll some resin on the inside and glass the outside. For something with good wood framing,plywood and fasteners and glue as used in building houses, not necessary.  Don’t even get me started on balsa core. 

Weight - yeah, that’s nice, but we’re not talking about an airplane. A couple hundred pounds really won’t make a meaningful difference on a travel trailer, might even be a plus in a crosswind. By the  time you put in a kitchen with cabinets, counters, stove, fridge, sink, microwave, toss in furniture, rugs, clothes, tools, bicycle or two, grill, sundry other stuff, gas bottles, the list goes on, a little extra skin weight doesn’t make a lot of difference.

Hope that’s of use

doc…

*2" hole in 2" solid lamination for a sonar, Milwaukee Hole Hawg, in low range, carbide hole saw with a long pilot drill and pitch it after that one hole. Drill from inside until the pilot drill comes through, then use that hole to go in, makes a much neater hole. That’s easy. Making the fairing block outside and the shims inside so the transponder is vertical, that’s the fun part.

 

Thanks Doc. You have a solid vantage point on this one. -J

What is the towing vehicle going to be?  

Completed weight will be a factor, much more so if it is a gasser versus a Diesel, and the mountainous west travel vs the flatter eastern half as well.  

It is very easy to not only overbuild, but to also stuff it with far too much weight and ‘just in case I might possibly want it’ junk, especially when one builds with a ‘no wasted space’ mentality.

With these two factors in mind I would think about weight, at each stage of the build.  Most every DIY interior Van/ travel trailer/ schoolbus build I have seen, is overbuilt by a factor of 3, and all that structure is not only weight, but wasted internal space.

With carpentry skills, 40 years of tool accumulation, and lots of longer bench clamps, consider making ones own panels, instead of buying Luan/plywood and glassing it.  

I recently made some  interior door panels  for my Van, from leftover cedar from my HWS builds, edged with Walnut.  3/16 to 1/4 inch thick boards ripped on a tablesaw from 2x4’s.  I was running low on wood and used regular pine on one panel.

2x6’s ripped on a Bandsaw, with a long fence and featherboard to keep it tight, would  allow at least 6 3/16" thick planks per 2x6, vs a 3/32 ich kerf tablesaw blade where only 5 are possible.

I edge glued with regular wood glue, and 5 foot clamps, sanded then rolled on the epoxy thickly on the outside, 2 or 3 coats within the chemical bond window, and one, maybee 2 layers on the inside, and predrilled screw holes, taped the underside and filled it with epoxy.  then drilled through epoxy afterwards. Basically waterproof. SS fasteners. Pretty.  No fiberglass needed.

 

I could imagine building a lightweight frame designed to accept different size homemade panels.

 With all the grain in one orientation, one can bend the panels around a fairly smooth radius, building something aerodynamic and stylish,  instead of a  white box to drag through the wind. 

The price of Luan panels or plywood these days can make the effort of making ones own panels more attractive, and ripped planks can be bookmatched, and symmetry = beauty.

If no insulation is required,intending on  visiting mild climates only,  white paint the outside  atop the cheaper PE boat  laminating resin rolled onto the wood, and leave the interior the warm wood bookmatches, or if long term UV exposure is not a concern, leave the exterior wood visible, and question the need for fiberglass, versus just rolling on laminating resin thickly in a few coats.  

 

On the electrical  side of the design, plan a battery box capable of holding  4 GC-2 golf cart batteries, and the supporting charger/inverter.solar charge controllers/DC distribution fuseblocks and bussbars to be nearby that battery box.  Each 6v golf cart battery weighs ~ 64 Lbs and all the weight on one side can really affect handling/braking.  Do consider ventilation. Such as a filtered floor intake to replace that which the roof fan(s) exhaust.  Solar panels atop are also wise, and designing the roof  structure for their  firm mounting should be considered at the design stage, as opposed to afterwards. 

There is so many factors to building an RV/travel trailer from scratch, and so many ready made RV’s are already just barely below their GVWR, before their water tanks are even filled, much less filled with owner’s possessions. 

 Overloaded tires / chassis on a summer highway, have, and will  continue to lead to disaster affecting far more than those piloting the  overloaded vehicle.


De nada, hope I didn’t come across as too much of a smartass 

Now, here’s the thing. I’ve spent a lot of time on boats, commercial fishing, and set up a lot of them. As I’ve gotten to my current stage of decrepitude I’ve come to like my comforts. Good kitchen/galley, a nice table to eat at, reading chair, you get the picture. 

And I like having my tools handy and the ability to do a little work, still. Tool storage and a micro-shop? Yeah, that would be great.

If I had the budget…and the desire to travel… a trailer might be kinda nice. 

And yeah, I could build one, start out with maybe a big landscape trailer, good used, around a grand. Making a box, well, glassed, framed, sheathed, insulated, lined/panelled, 3 grand, maybe more. 

Carpet, cabinets, counters, range, refrigerator, sink, microwave, TV, air conditioner, mattresses, other furniture, lights, wiring, plumbing, tanks -it starts adding up. You could easily get into this for 30 grand. 

Or, buy a decent used toy hauler type, something like this . It’s local to me, but have at Craigslist and see what you find. 

doc…

 

@Doc, no worries.

@WRC68, looking great! Good comments about balancing loads too.

@Biggreen, any of this helping you? I saw somewhere else online that the lid of Martin’s camper tips up at the back while camping. nice feature, standing headroom is always a plus for changing clothes, wetsuit, etc.

 

Thanks again everyone for the help. And sorry to be late to respond. For some reason I have trouble replying. I changed browsers and am hoping this will take care of my issue.

Doc! Thanks! I think I’m going to watch a few of those zillion videos you mentioned. I’ve only ever worked with epoxy, but the cost and ease of what you’ve described sounds great. And I hear you. Ever since this Covid craziness began, I don’t deny myself anything. On this project I’m making certain I have creature comforts. I’d hoped this baby would cost me around $10k, but I suspect it’ll be closer to $15k. Saying that, the plan I’m copying would cost me $37-40k to buy, so I’m ok with what I’m spending. I’m  99% done welding my frame. I bought mostly damaged steel and was able to cut out the bad portions. The whole frame will cost only about $1000. And it’ll have a slide out. The thing that surprises me most will be the cost of my own carpentry part. Costs are nuts these days.

wrcs…love the wood! And serious thanks for the heads up on many factors most wouldn’t consider. And you’re right. Most home builds are WAY beyond what’s needed. I was guilty of that on a bus I converted. But I’m hoping not to fall into that trap, so I’m watching the details as best I can. On electrical and batteries I’m going the lithium route. Ive already purchased two 100ah batteries. And combined the damn things weigh only 50 lbs! And solar is part of the plan…but I’m still doing my homework.

jrandy…I’m fortunate to have a place that’ll cut eps to whatever size I need. Doc is right. And if I can piggyback a spray foam job, I will. If not, I do have ideas for my scrap eps and some sheet stock to make my own insulated panels. And if the I don’t do the fiberglass exterior, I do have some Craftsman style ideas for an aluminum skin.

Thanks again everyone for the help. It’s why I came here. I knew there’d be some good info.

This I a school bus I converted back in 2008. Cut the roof off, raised it 18", and welded it back on. 




(chuckling) -  you see a lot of people coming here asking about ‘what is this resin substance you speak of’, absolute basic level stuff. Which is fine, no shame in that, the only foolish question is one that isn’t asked. 

And then there’s those with skills already, looking to bounce some intelligent questions around, brainstorm a bit…

First off, really nice job on the bus. Raising it 18" and rewelding is hard, to do it without a lot of distortion The inside is really nicely done, yacht grade. I’m impressed. Really. Also, excellent taste, a lot of people ‘wood things to death’ such that it’s like a dungeon or something, dark and depressing. This isn’t. 

Now, the skin of it. I’ll note that there’s a lot of sanding that’s gonna be involved if you do glass it yourself. And by the time you gel coat it and so on it’s gonna be a bit heavy. If you can buy fiberglass or aluminum sheet stock panels and stick them on it’d probably competitive on price versus going from scratch yourself and a helluva lot less work, you can be on the road a lot sooner. And that’s important. 

A few thoughts, feel free to ignore them-

Solar - yeah, if you’re gonna be real remote. But between charge controllers, panels, battery banks, inverters, DC wiring, AC wiring, the list goes on, it’s expensive and complicated. And they run out of steam pretty quick if you’re running, say, power tools unless you have a really heavy duty system. Or just a decent sized fridge. Forget about an air conditioner. On the other hand, Harbor Freight will sell you a pretty quiet generator pretty cheap, buy the extended warranty, it’s worth it if you’re gonna be using it a lot .

More on power and such, in a catty-cornered way. The Lifetime Senior Pass that they have for federal lands, not just national parks, and a surprising number of those have trailer/RV areas with utility hookups you may get discounts on. Along with a lot more good stuff.I was really surprised by how many places that honor them and what they offer.

I blathered on about good used ‘toy hauler’ setups. Couple things about that - 

First off, if I go someplace it’s not necessarily to surf. Or just to surf. Hunting, fishing, ride the bike, ride the motorcycle, stargaze, whatever. And I feel naked without some tools. If I had all of that stuffed into the living quarters, things would get ugly soon. Enter the toy hauler, 20-some feet of trailer with an included ten foot storage and workshop area. 

Among other things, ding repair is a nice way to supplement the Social Security. Or making things for sale or custom, or simply the projects that pursue you through life no matter what. 

There are some, very spartan living quarters stuffed into the front of a work trailer, things look like Darth Vader’s hat. Probably ideal for a pit crew, with race car. 

But there’s others that have a very nice living area, all the comforts, plus that area in the back for the rest of your life. The one I saw locally for six grand, probably has particle board cabinets, but it’s cheap and building much better stuff out of real wood is easy for the lies of you or me, likewise if it’s real cheap because the frame is getting a little chewy. A lot of the people who have them need help to put in a spice rack, they give up.Or they just got old. You’d obviously have no difficulty doing anything it needed. And again, you’d be on the road a lot sooner. 

As I said, feel free to ignore. And if you don’t-

hope that’s of use

doc…

 

Downloaded the pics, resized the files, and then I noticed you already got them up, so its all good. The rig looks awesome.