Wanted to ask for some feedback on a shape I’m looking to get cut for summer:
Surfer is 6'1" ~200lbs on a good day, intermediate
Building it to surf mainly in chest+ Trestles but also hope it can hold it's own on the local beach breaks.
Flat entry to 1/8" single concave in the middle and a flat exit in the last foot of tail
Fin placement at roughly 8.5" with 1/8 toe (would like to measure the toe to meet 1"-2" in front of the nose).
Questions:
Is it worth exploring a 2+1 setup to experiment? I don't necessarily love the idea of using the board as a single fin, but I think the shape would work as a single fin and it seems to open the board up to a variety of different fin setups, including a small trailer.
In terms of the toe, I'm under the assumption you want a little more toe on twins to hold in larger waves. Should I bump the toe to 3/16 or even 1/4?
Also this thought translates to the fin convergence point: i.e - Would I bring the convergence closer to the nose to increase toe? So instead of 2" in front, if I wanted a little more control and pivot in larger waves, I'd move it to meet 0"-1" off the nose?
Rocker: I esentially tried to copy the 6'9" R rocker profile, could probably use some tweaking but I'd like to stay as vanilla as possible with the first version of the board
Any feedback and advice would be greatly appreciated.
It seems to me that what you have will work in the conditions you’re describing.
The only thing I’d submit for your consideration is maybe thinking about doing it as a twinzer. Move the main fin back a little and use a single FCS plug for the leader or else do a glass-on. A twinzer will hold better, especially on your backside.
Appreciate the feedback. I didn’t even consider a twinzer but I see where you’re going and I think that style fits the desired performance better.
I haven’t really dug into twinzer setups so pardon the ignorance, but I would essentially just use some futures boxes for the main (back) fins at like 7.5" | 1" off the rail and install a single FCS plug 12" off the tail, 1" off the rail.
Toe them both the same, whether that’s 2" convergence off the nose or basic 3/16" toe?
You could move the main back to 7.5" or you could split the difference at 8". I think some of it depends on your stance and how heavy your rear foot is.
The way I have run twinzers is to overlap the fins by 1/4" or 3/8", same toe but with more cant on the twinzer. Keep the mains pretty upright, like 4* or even 2*. One advantage for you as a surfer of larger stature is that the twinzer adds more fin area to the rail, 'cause most twinnie templates aren’t big enough for the bigger surfers. Other than that your template has some curve in the tail and rocker so you should be able to put the board anywhere you want on a wave like Trestles.
Another thing you could consider for a twin is moving the wide point forward a little. If you do you’ll be putting more volume under your chest for paddling and lengthening and slightly straightening the rail line in the rear. That’s a love/hate thing for a lot of surfers, though. If you surf more off your front foot you might like that but if you surf more off your rear foot that might work against you.
Does the diagram below match a good starting point for twinzer fin setup? Pink measurement being the Mains (futures box) and Green is the single FCS tab for the canards:
4.25" off the Futures box leaves 1/4" of overlap on the canard fins, right?
Should I keep the fins 1.25" off the rail like a normal quad? If I move them closer (1"?) it will just increase hold/drive/pivot-ness, correct?
I think the pic distorts the amount ot toe-in you’re talking about, but other than that I think you’ve got the idea. Personally, I favor running the trailing edge of the main ~1" off the rail. On twinzer installs I usually end up with the leader being ~1" away from and running parallel to the main fin (trailing edge of the leader overlapping the leading edge of the main). Obviously, the actual measurement for the toe in will vary according to the fin sizes. So, set the toe for the main and then run the leader parallel to that.
Another piece of unsolicited advice I’ll give you is to not use the plug for the canard that Future sells (assuming they still sell it). That triangular plug is a POS and is notorious for rolling under torque or losing the fin. Better to use the FCS plugs. Even better (and my preference) is to cut a 9* Fusion box in half and install those first, then come back to do the Future install after. The reason being that if there’s any overlap between the two it’s better to cut into the canard plug than vice-versa. Future boxes are already prone to twisting/rolling under torque and twin fins have a lot of surface area.
It’s a long explanation, but the first time you do one of these it’ll make sense.
BTW, Greenlight’s ad for the Fusion boxes shows them being used for bonzer runners, which also have a lot of cant.
Yeah the image is definitely not to scale for the toe.
Appreciate the unsolicited advice, I was scoping out that canard futures box but it didn’t seem like there were a lot of options in fins so I was going to go with a vanilla FSC tab.
It does seems like I could use a 1/2" futures box for the canards and buy a set of these Stu Kenson canards, but they also come in a single tab version so I think that keeps my options open for experimenting more than committing to solely futures bases.
This Stu set seems like a solid twinzer option with the single tab. If I end up not liking it I could always go the route of glass on canards.
Follow up:
If I buy the 9* cant canards, I'd need to install a 0* box, right? The 9* box would allow for a bit more flexibility in fins, but would a 0* box provide a better foundation for fin experimentation?
IMO the main fin on the Kenson set (17.2") is too small for a 200# surfer, even when using with a canard. On the other hand it does have an upright rake so that’s good. The large version (19.55") is closer to what you need, and TBH I’d suggest an even bigger fin like the AMT (20.55"). I think the EN fin (22.75") is probably more fin than you need. A couple of the others have more rake which can work with a twinzer but you’ll get more pivot off an upright template.
For the canard you apparently can still order the C5 canard, albeit in their Thermotech plastic. $10 ea. That material is sufficient for use in a canard. If you want a matching set then maybe hit up Tru Ames or Rainbow and be prepared to wait a bit. The advantage with the customs is you can call out exactly what you want. And you’re not putting up with the flimsy honeycomb construction. Surfboards come and go but fins last a long time so it’s worth spending $20 more to get good ones.
If you call around to Surf Supply or Bashams or Foam-EZ they may even have a set of the C5 fins laying around. It could happen.
Pay attention to this first paragraph regarding trailing edge and and leader edge of the main fin. That is what will get you where you need to be. The toe and distance off the rail will fall into place from there. The main fin placement is the key and the starting point for the lead fin.
Alright this has been useful. Trying to finalize how I’m going to set this up for the glasser, but I updated my crappy paint diagram with the feedback from here.
Essentially I measure out the mains to be 1" off rail with a 3/16 toe, then use that leading edge and move it 1" closer to the rail, instead of measuring a new trailing edge altogether. Is that right?
Also having trouble conceptualizing how to lay out the single FCS plug to minimize overlap at 1/4". Would it be unwise to just use a full Fusion box for each canard so I could move the canard forward (for science) but keep the back as the main placement? Or is that trying to do too much.
You can see the overlap and the additional cant on the leader. As well, you can see how much fin area he’s using even though he personally has a slender build. He is not a 200# surfer.
