That was a cool time at FW Josh. Surfing Mags top ten shapers of all time, I was very honored but I'm not sure you can boil it down to ten, maybe one hundred but so many have had great influence. I grew up in Cocoa Beach. Pretty much everyone was involved in the space program at some level, all the parents. I would go to parties with my parents and all of us surf guys would be huddled in a corner talking surf while the geek dads would be huddled in a corner talking about launching a Saturn 5. We thought we were so cool but 50 years after we're gone no one will remember anything we did but in a thousand years they'll still be talking about what those geeky dads did. They had a saying back then, "Low tech is high tech," which is pretty much the same as KISS. Rolling drums was a way to get it done.
Hi Wingnut. My opinion on foam has been, for a very long time, that it's all about the waves your riding vs. foam density. If your riding small waves, under head high, you should be riding EPS. Lower density rides better and the lower you go the better it'll ride. As you get into some juice begin to ride higher density EPS, maybe XPS. As the waves get more serious you begin to move into higher densities in urethane and then if you into really big stuff you begin riding wood cores. Watching the pro guys now, especially Slater, they generally are riding EPS and when the swell starts pumping they switch to PU. Then you watch the tow in guys and their using high density PU or balsa. I like epoxy over everything (bet that's a surprise) because it's easier, stronger and nicer to work with. In my latter days of board building laminating became my favorite job because it was clean, quiet and not real physical. I'd go to work in the evening when it was cool, turn on the music and shoot half a dozen sides. PE isn't like that. Rush, rush, rush with a mask on and acetone and vapors. As for tips this place has always been the place to ask specific questions. Lots of good stuff here.
Hi Mattwho, the guys I work with in FL are using wider tails (16") in gutless crap with deep concave running all the way through the bottoms now. 1/4 to 3/8ths deep. Mostly four fins or three fins with a small fin in the back. Just gets down to planing in nothing.
Greg, thank you for your participation and comments. A question regarding EPS/epoxy layups and expansion. Frequently, on my eps boards, I've witnessed the following that I'll try and explain clearly. After a couple of years I see a phenomenon where the foam has very slightly expaned (or the stringer slightly retracted, but that seems less likely since it has happened with balsa, samba, poplar, mahogony...) leaving a micro depression along the stringer from nose to tail. Pretty regular. No delamination, no apparent loss of structural integrity, but on a nice polished longboard it does bug a bit. Heck, even on my other boards it bugs a bit.
Medium density blanks - hand layups usually in 6+6/6 or 6+4/6. Rarely have a chance to heat up as I surf virtually only mornings/evenings because of skin issues.
I've seen this on poly/pu boards as well, but less systematically. Any insights are appreciated!
I have had similar experiences as Jeffrey, but in my case it was only when doing epoxy (RR kwik kick) over a poly blank, and only when pigments were added to the epoxy. My working theory is that the pigment kept the epoxy more flexible than it might have been, and thus susceptible to expansion...mostly likely candidate being either gas or heat (or both) from the stringer/glueline/glass combo. Working solution has been 1) no dark colors for epoxy over poly and 2) less pigment than I'd typically use for good color saturation. any other suggestions? would love to have more freedom to do color epoxy work over poly blanks. Thanks,
Hi Mattwho, the guys I work with in FL are using wider tails (16") in gutless crap with deep concave running all the way through the bottoms now. 1/4 to 3/8ths deep. Mostly four fins or three fins with a small fin in the back. Just gets down to planing in nothing.
That's interesting .........Ive recently built a 5'6" .....it's a fish tail , and 5 1/2 " between the tips of the fish tail. The original plan was for a twinzer cluster , but the more I look at it , the more I see a twin , with a small centre fin near the tail , to eliminate that "skating" thing. It has full width concave from front foot , going to flat behind the twin-fins.....I remember my first 70's twin fin , which had the fin tips level with the pod of the board........I never liked that tail skating feel when I tried the more modern MR type twinnies......??????.... any thoughts on that Greg ?
gotta disagree Reverb - lots of great info here on everything from surf history to shapes and technique. To be clear: any shaper who volunteers for the "hot seat" is allowed plenty of leeway in explaining, and expressing enthusiasm for their own shapes, products, etc. And there are a lot of us, myself included, who prefer epoxy over poly resin, and use it exclusively.
If you have a question, ask up. If you just want to gripe about the forum, or the thread, or epoxy resin, find another thread to post in. The ground rules for the hot seat threads are we ask the questions, hot seat shaper answers. Re-read Greg Tate's first post in the thread.
If you have a question, ask up. If you just want to gripe about the forum, or the thread, or epoxy resin, find another thread to post in. The ground rules for the hot seat threads are we ask the questions, hot seat shaper answers. Re-read Greg Tate's first post in the thread.
Agreed. Pretty out of line remarks.
I think a little leeway on the self promotion and product name dropping is fitting for these hot seat features. Why not let a guy talk about what he does without restrictions or sanctions? Putting tight parameters on what's off limits would discourage many experienced guys from participating.
like
0
“That which can be asserted without evidence, can be dismissed without evidence.”
For surfboards, do you post-cure at the end (after everything) or before final sanding (after all epoxy layers, before any other materials or finishes)?
What do you think of acrylic floor sealers and 2-part automotive clears over epoxy?
like
0
http://pushheretosavealife.com/
Be safe, have fun. -J
That was a cool time at FW Josh. Surfing Mags top ten shapers of all time, I was very honored but I'm not sure you can boil it down to ten, maybe one hundred but so many have had great influence. I grew up in Cocoa Beach. Pretty much everyone was involved in the space program at some level, all the parents. I would go to parties with my parents and all of us surf guys would be huddled in a corner talking surf while the geek dads would be huddled in a corner talking about launching a Saturn 5. We thought we were so cool but 50 years after we're gone no one will remember anything we did but in a thousand years they'll still be talking about what those geeky dads did. They had a saying back then, "Low tech is high tech," which is pretty much the same as KISS. Rolling drums was a way to get it done.
Hi Wingnut. My opinion on foam has been, for a very long time, that it's all about the waves your riding vs. foam density. If your riding small waves, under head high, you should be riding EPS. Lower density rides better and the lower you go the better it'll ride. As you get into some juice begin to ride higher density EPS, maybe XPS. As the waves get more serious you begin to move into higher densities in urethane and then if you into really big stuff you begin riding wood cores. Watching the pro guys now, especially Slater, they generally are riding EPS and when the swell starts pumping they switch to PU. Then you watch the tow in guys and their using high density PU or balsa. I like epoxy over everything (bet that's a surprise) because it's easier, stronger and nicer to work with. In my latter days of board building laminating became my favorite job because it was clean, quiet and not real physical. I'd go to work in the evening when it was cool, turn on the music and shoot half a dozen sides. PE isn't like that. Rush, rush, rush with a mask on and acetone and vapors. As for tips this place has always been the place to ask specific questions. Lots of good stuff here.
Hi Mattwho, the guys I work with in FL are using wider tails (16") in gutless crap with deep concave running all the way through the bottoms now. 1/4 to 3/8ths deep. Mostly four fins or three fins with a small fin in the back. Just gets down to planing in nothing.
Greg, thank you for your participation and comments. A question regarding EPS/epoxy layups and expansion. Frequently, on my eps boards, I've witnessed the following that I'll try and explain clearly. After a couple of years I see a phenomenon where the foam has very slightly expaned (or the stringer slightly retracted, but that seems less likely since it has happened with balsa, samba, poplar, mahogony...) leaving a micro depression along the stringer from nose to tail. Pretty regular. No delamination, no apparent loss of structural integrity, but on a nice polished longboard it does bug a bit. Heck, even on my other boards it bugs a bit.
Medium density blanks - hand layups usually in 6+6/6 or 6+4/6. Rarely have a chance to heat up as I surf virtually only mornings/evenings because of skin issues.
I've seen this on poly/pu boards as well, but less systematically. Any insights are appreciated!
I have had similar experiences as Jeffrey, but in my case it was only when doing epoxy (RR kwik kick) over a poly blank, and only when pigments were added to the epoxy. My working theory is that the pigment kept the epoxy more flexible than it might have been, and thus susceptible to expansion...mostly likely candidate being either gas or heat (or both) from the stringer/glueline/glass combo. Working solution has been 1) no dark colors for epoxy over poly and 2) less pigment than I'd typically use for good color saturation. any other suggestions? would love to have more freedom to do color epoxy work over poly blanks. Thanks,
http://www.currumbinwoodworks.com.au/
...epoxy is not easier and nicer than polyesters as you say...but you are the seller so...
the fact is all the problems that people mention here and using your brand that s appropiate one; more problems with the others.
None problem in all type of weather with polyesters except in extremely low temp...but in that case epoxy cannot play.
then this thread is turning in a publicity of a resin brand.
gotta disagree Reverb - lots of great info here on everything from surf history to shapes and technique. To be clear: any shaper who volunteers for the "hot seat" is allowed plenty of leeway in explaining, and expressing enthusiasm for their own shapes, products, etc. And there are a lot of us, myself included, who prefer epoxy over poly resin, and use it exclusively.
If you have a question, ask up. If you just want to gripe about the forum, or the thread, or epoxy resin, find another thread to post in. The ground rules for the hot seat threads are we ask the questions, hot seat shaper answers. Re-read Greg Tate's first post in the thread.
Agreed. Pretty out of line remarks.
I think a little leeway on the self promotion and product name dropping is fitting for these hot seat features. Why not let a guy talk about what he does without restrictions or sanctions? Putting tight parameters on what's off limits would discourage many experienced guys from participating.
“That which can be asserted without evidence, can be dismissed without evidence.”
Hi Greg-
Thanks for being in the hot seat. -J
For surfboards, do you post-cure at the end (after everything) or before final sanding (after all epoxy layers, before any other materials or finishes)?
What do you think of acrylic floor sealers and 2-part automotive clears over epoxy?
http://pushheretosavealife.com/
Be safe, have fun. -J
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