"unless you were there 48 years ago or so, you will never understand how amazing the shortboard revolution was"
so, so true. One month enjoying my 9'8 Trestle Special in well overhead SF OB surf, the next month stripping the glass and hand shaping it with a surform and block plane into a 7'0. 3 months later stripping down an old Hansen and shaping it into a 6'0. A wild charge into the future,in our area led by Dick Keating, out in front as always.
And thanks for shovelling some dirt on the spiral V, Bill, it had been debated to death.
My question has to do with fin placement. Assume a 7'8 x 21 fun gun, where would you place a thruster set, and conversely a quad set, and how would you set them up. Also be interested in any thoughts on fins, i.e., system vs. glass-ons, current favorites, see any changes coming in fin design....
Man do I miss those 80s airbrush jobs. That is one thing that is really missing with today's boards. Loved it back when guys like Pottz had entire quivers of airbrushed boards. Today's magic marker scribble is no replacement. Who was the artist who sprayed these? Big thumbs up!!!
Man do I miss those 80s airbrush jobs. That is one thing that is really missing with today's boards. Loved it back when guys like Pottz had entire quivers of airbrushed boards. Today's magic marker scribble is no replacement. Who was the artist who sprayed these? Big thumbs up!!!
Aloha Mako
My airbrusher at this time was Suzi Gillette. Mother of Gavin Gillette...!
Current photo and one from about 30 years ago
I totally agree with you about colors. Color is inspirational and lifts the spirit. It differentiates things and give them personality. Good design also includes how customers are effected by appearence. Good design stimulates desire and drives sales.
Hi Bill- I just want to echo what Oneula said... Thanks for doing this. And I would really enjoy your response to my question (via PM) about the Clark 7'0"B that you designed, particularly was there an ideal size that you had in mind ? I have one (green) that I want to shape a single fin out of, to use as one of my regular boards...Other than encouraging me to make it a thruster, are there any rocker/bottom contour updates you would suggest? Updates from what was standard when singles were all we had? Thanks- Jim
Hi Bill- I just want to echo what Oneula said... Thanks for doing this. And I would really enjoy your response to my question (via PM) about the Clark 7'0"B that you designed, particularly was there an ideal size that you had in mind ? I have one (green) that I want to shape a single fin out of, to use as one of my regular boards...Other than encouraging me to make it a thruster, are there any rocker/bottom contour updates you would suggest? Updates from what was standard when singles were all we had? Thanks- Jim
Aloha Jim
Cool that you have one of those 70Bs. My blanks while thinner then previous blanks of the era, were still really thick compared to todays contemporary boards. I was trying to get Clark to get on board with a Quiver concept but they just weren't seeing the need back then. I was looking forward a big hunk and it was very clear to me where thickness was going but not so to them. Many of the blank plugs I sent them, they let sit awhile becuase they were afraid they were too thin. I wanted to create A, B, C versions of each blank. The A Being thinner, narrower, with more rocker. The C being thicker, wider and with less rocker. The B, being somewhere between the others. We never got there, but now there are similar things happening though they are not well integrated.
The 70B was designed as a single fin blank. For boards 6'8" to 7'0". And since I couldn't make the A and C versions, I had to strike a conservative middle of the road position fot it. My blanks were typically, designed as BLANKS, that is, I wasn't trying to trap the customer into making a specific board. But rather was providing a BLANK canvas upon which they could paint their particular board and have it fit within.
Additionally, I usually didn't give away my bottom rockers, so the Natural Rocker in the blank was rarely what I was using in my boards made from those blanks. Therefore, I would highly suggest that you make a single fin from the blank as it likely won't have enough rocker in it to make a contemporary tri fin, without having to thin out the ends too much to add bottom rocker. It depends a lot on the rocker that was glued into the blank. As tri fins emerged, many others created custom public rockers for my blanks. My personal rockers were always private.
If you make it as a single fin, I would add more rocker and a wider tail then what was common back then. I would have to know a lot more about you, your size and your experience before advising specific numbers and even then I would be guessing a lot compared to how detailed I am with customers here.
Regarding bottom contours for a single fin, that would depend on the waves and conditions you will ride it in and also all the other measurements of the board. Template, thickness, you, etc. Generally though, I would make it flatish in nose, a very slight vee through forward center, increasing toward the tail. Maximum vee at 24" or so, fading out to flat in the tail. Depending of course, on rocker, tail width and fin.
Not sure the era you are thinking of emulating as a single fin, or the tail width you migh use. But you should use a different fin then the popular Brewer fin of the mid 70's. I can send you my personal template if you like but it would vary depending on the measurements of the overall board, the waves, and you. Or I could make one for you if you don't have access to making a fin yourself.
I appreciate the explanation, and would very much like your input on the dimensions I ultimately settle on and the fin template.....I'll PM you rather than take up space here that could be better used to answer other people's questions.
Great stuff Bill, you are and always have been a great read. I have also always enjoyed your respect of the reader. Your accurate, consise and easy to understand. Your vision is one of the clearest in our biz, your experience second to none. Thanks for a very entertaining evening. Cheers.
"unless you were there 48 years ago or so, you will never understand how amazing the shortboard revolution was"
so, so true. One month enjoying my 9'8 Trestle Special in well overhead SF OB surf, the next month stripping the glass and hand shaping it with a surform and block plane into a 7'0. 3 months later stripping down an old Hansen and shaping it into a 6'0. A wild charge into the future,in our area led by Dick Keating, out in front as always.
And thanks for shovelling some dirt on the spiral V, Bill, it had been debated to death.
My question has to do with fin placement. Assume a 7'8 x 21 fun gun, where would you place a thruster set, and conversely a quad set, and how would you set them up. Also be interested in any thoughts on fins, i.e., system vs. glass-ons, current favorites, see any changes coming in fin design....
cheers
Just reading.
Can't help by self.
Fellow, once a Harbor rider.
Winter of 67/68 while surfing El Cap bumped into Mctavish.
Next day I ditched my 9-10 Sol for a William Dennis 7-10 stringless V.
Took me a week to stand up!
"Thanks for the memories"!
I would rather be someone's shot of whiskey, than everyone's cup of tea.
www.mattysurfboards.com
Man do I miss those 80s airbrush jobs. That is one thing that is really missing with today's boards. Loved it back when guys like Pottz had entire quivers of airbrushed boards. Today's magic marker scribble is no replacement. Who was the artist who sprayed these? Big thumbs up!!!
C
Aloha Mako
My airbrusher at this time was Suzi Gillette. Mother of Gavin Gillette...!
Current photo and one from about 30 years ago
I totally agree with you about colors. Color is inspirational and lifts the spirit. It differentiates things and give them personality. Good design also includes how customers are effected by appearence. Good design stimulates desire and drives sales.
7'7%22 Barnfield ST Zig Zag Airbrush Final Bill & Suzi.jpg
Suzi Shinoda Gillette Airbrusher 1987.jpg
Just want to say mahalo bill.. and i hope you and your famiy are doing well
same to all the others (barry/greg) that gave some time to do this
that's all just a big mahalo, malama, aloha, and a hawaiian hug
don't think that's been said enough to guys who do what you do over all these years..
surfers can often be a selfish crowd.
"ain't no big ting brudda"
You humble me Oneula. I am happy to serve here among my peers.
Thank you for the Aloha
BB
Hi Bill- I just want to echo what Oneula said... Thanks for doing this. And I would really enjoy your response to my question (via PM) about the Clark 7'0"B that you designed, particularly was there an ideal size that you had in mind ? I have one (green) that I want to shape a single fin out of, to use as one of my regular boards...Other than encouraging me to make it a thruster, are there any rocker/bottom contour updates you would suggest? Updates from what was standard when singles were all we had? Thanks- Jim
Aloha Jim
Cool that you have one of those 70Bs. My blanks while thinner then previous blanks of the era, were still really thick compared to todays contemporary boards. I was trying to get Clark to get on board with a Quiver concept but they just weren't seeing the need back then. I was looking forward a big hunk and it was very clear to me where thickness was going but not so to them. Many of the blank plugs I sent them, they let sit awhile becuase they were afraid they were too thin. I wanted to create A, B, C versions of each blank. The A Being thinner, narrower, with more rocker. The C being thicker, wider and with less rocker. The B, being somewhere between the others. We never got there, but now there are similar things happening though they are not well integrated.
The 70B was designed as a single fin blank. For boards 6'8" to 7'0". And since I couldn't make the A and C versions, I had to strike a conservative middle of the road position fot it. My blanks were typically, designed as BLANKS, that is, I wasn't trying to trap the customer into making a specific board. But rather was providing a BLANK canvas upon which they could paint their particular board and have it fit within.
Additionally, I usually didn't give away my bottom rockers, so the Natural Rocker in the blank was rarely what I was using in my boards made from those blanks. Therefore, I would highly suggest that you make a single fin from the blank as it likely won't have enough rocker in it to make a contemporary tri fin, without having to thin out the ends too much to add bottom rocker. It depends a lot on the rocker that was glued into the blank. As tri fins emerged, many others created custom public rockers for my blanks. My personal rockers were always private.
If you make it as a single fin, I would add more rocker and a wider tail then what was common back then. I would have to know a lot more about you, your size and your experience before advising specific numbers and even then I would be guessing a lot compared to how detailed I am with customers here.
Regarding bottom contours for a single fin, that would depend on the waves and conditions you will ride it in and also all the other measurements of the board. Template, thickness, you, etc. Generally though, I would make it flatish in nose, a very slight vee through forward center, increasing toward the tail. Maximum vee at 24" or so, fading out to flat in the tail. Depending of course, on rocker, tail width and fin.
Not sure the era you are thinking of emulating as a single fin, or the tail width you migh use. But you should use a different fin then the popular Brewer fin of the mid 70's. I can send you my personal template if you like but it would vary depending on the measurements of the overall board, the waves, and you. Or I could make one for you if you don't have access to making a fin yourself.
Hope this helps.
Thanks Bill-
I appreciate the explanation, and would very much like your input on the dimensions I ultimately settle on and the fin template.....I'll PM you rather than take up space here that could be better used to answer other people's questions.
Regards-
Jim
Great stuff Bill, you are and always have been a great read. I have also always enjoyed your respect of the reader. Your accurate, consise and easy to understand. Your vision is one of the clearest in our biz, your experience second to none. Thanks for a very entertaining evening. Cheers.
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